presidential debate 2020

Wreck on the Green Highway

Most of us are trying to forget Tuesday night's debate debacle. But one interaction is worth revisiting.

Last Tuesday night, I couldn't take my eyes off Chris Wallace's haplessly bad moderating, Joe Biden's timidity, and Donald Trump's Tasmanian Devil routine during the first presidential debate.


But, lo and behold, three quarters of an hour into what TV commentators later openly called a "fiasco" or a "sh*tshow," something happened that hadn't happened in a presidential debate for 12 years.

Moderator Chris Wallace of Fox News —yes, that Fox News — abruptly changed the evening's topics and tone by asking President Trump about climate change, a topic that wasn't even supposed to be on the evening's agenda:

Wallace: The forest fires in the West are raging now. They have burned millions of acres. They have displaced hundreds of thousands of people. When state officials there blamed the fires on climate change. Mr. President, you said, I don't think the science knows. Over your four years, you have pulled the US out of the Paris Climate Accord. You have rolled back a number of Obama Environmental records, what do you believe about the science of climate change and what will you do in the next four years to confront it?

Trump: I want crystal clean water and air. I want beautiful clean air. We have now the lowest carbon… If you look at our numbers right now, we are doing phenomenally. But I haven't destroyed our businesses. Our businesses aren't put out of commission. If you look at the Paris Accord, it was a disaster from our standpoint. And people are actually very happy about what's going on because our businesses are doing well. As far as the fires are concerned, you need forest management. In addition to everything else, the forest floors are loaded up with trees, dead trees that are years old and they're like tinder and leaves and everything else. You drop a cigarette in there the whole forest burns down. You've got to have forest management.

So Wallace pinned Trump down, sort of, on whether he's a climate denier:

Wallace: What do you believe about the science of climate change, sir?

Trump: I believe that we have to do everything we can to have immaculate air, immaculate water, and do whatever else we can that's good. We're planting a billion trees, the Billion Tree Project and it's very exciting for a lot of people.

Wallace: You believe that human pollution, gas, greenhouse gas emissions contributes to the global warming of this planet.

Trump: I think a lot of things do, but I think to an extent, yes. I think to an extent, yes, but I also think we have to do better management of our forest. Every year I get the call. California's burning, California's burning. If that was cleaned, if that were, if you had forest management, good forest management, you wouldn't be getting those calls. In Europe, they live they're forest cities. They call forest cities. They maintain their forest. They manage their forest. I was with the head of a major country, it's a forest city. He said, "Sir, we have trees that are far more, they ignite much easier than California. There shouldn't be that problem." I spoke with the Governor about it. I'm getting along very well with the governor. But I said, "At some point you can't every year have hundreds of thousands of acres of land just burned to the ground." That's burning down because of a lack of management.

You may recall that President Trump had referred to this as raking the forest floor. Yup, he did. A few minutes later, Wallace gave a chance to Biden:

Wallace: All right, Vice President Biden. I'd like you to respond to the president's climate change record but I also want to ask you about a concern. You propose $2 trillion in green jobs. You talk about new limits, not abolishing, but new limits on fracking. Ending the use of fossil fuels to generate electricity by 2035 and zero net admission of greenhouse gases by 2050. The president says a lot of these things would tank the economy and cost millions of jobs.

Biden: He's absolutely wrong, number one. Number two, if in fact, during our administration in the Recovery Act, I was in charge able to bring down the cost of renewable energy to cheaper than or as cheap as coal and gas and oil. Nobody's going to build another coal fired plant in America. No one's going to build another oil fire plant in America. They're going to move to renewable energy. Number one, number two, we're going to make sure that we are able to take the federal fleet and turn it into a fleet that's run on their electric vehicles. Making sure that we can do that, we're going to put 500,000 charging stations in all of the highways that we're going to be building in the future. We're going to build a economy that in fact is going to provide for the ability of us to take 4 million buildings and make sure that they in fact are weatherized in a way that in fact will they'll emit significantly less gas and oil ..."

They spoke, and argued, over climate and environment for several more minutes, making it the most extensive presidential candidates' environmental think-fest in history. It devolved, with Trump attempting to link Biden to the "radical," "socialist" Green New Deal proposal he now says will cost $100 trillion, a hallucinatory sum that would make Doctor Evil blush.

For his part, Biden says he does not endorse all of the sweeping Green New Deal goals.

Let's add to the mix President Trump's announcement late Thursday night that he and the First Lady have tested positive for COVID-19 and its potentially immense implications for those in all levels of government.

We've got your science denial right here, Mr. President.

Peter Dykstra is our weekend editor and columnist. His views do not necessarily represent those of Environmental Health News, The Daily Climate or publisher, Environmental Health Sciences.

A patient sitting in a hospital bed next to a table with a meal

Offering vegan food as default cuts hospital emissions by 22%

Sodexo UK and Ireland has announced the results of its latest effort to cut foodservice and catering emissions through plant-forward menus.

A woman holding a fan and holding her hand to her forehead on a hot day

Record Southern California heat wave raises deadly health risks

Temperatures up to 35°F above normal could exceed 100°F in Southern California , with warm nights heightening the risk of heat illness and death.

A view of a wind turbine from below
Credit: A. C./Unsplash+

Aging wind turbines are a massive clean energy opportunity

Upgrading existing wind farms is a climate win hiding in plain sight, according to a new nationwide analysis.

A person sitting on a dock breaking the ice on a lake

Ice used to be safe. Warming winters are changing that

Warming winters are making ice thinner and less predictable, leading to more drownings as people fall through while fishing, hunting and recreating on frozen waters.
Two wooden chairs next to a field that has a solar shade panel over it

How Ann Arbor, Michigan, is creating its own clean energy utility

Investor-owned utilities have been slow to ditch oil and gas. The city of Ann Arbor plans to boost access to renewables through a new dual-service model.
A marshland environment with a shoreline and a duck sitting at the edge of the water

Big Oil knew it was wrecking Louisiana’s coast, records show

Parish lawsuits, including one in front of the Supreme Court, could make oil giants pay to restore the state’s vanishing marshes.

An illustration of donald trump looking at the viewer

4 ways Trump is sabotaging climate action around the world

In just one year, Trump has derailed an international carbon tax, boosted fossil fuel forecasts, and sought to silence an island nation.
From our Newsroom
Multiple Houston-area oil and gas facilities that have violated pollution laws are seeking permit renewals

Multiple Houston-area oil and gas facilities that have violated pollution laws are seeking permit renewals

One facility has emitted cancer-causing chemicals into waterways at levels up to 520% higher than legal limits.

Regulators are underestimating health impacts from air pollution: Study

Regulators are underestimating health impacts from air pollution: Study

"The reality is, we are not exposed to one chemical at a time.”

Pennsylvania governor Josh Shapiro speaks with the state flag and American flag behind him.

Two years into his term, has Gov. Shapiro kept his promises to regulate Pennsylvania’s fracking industry?

A new report assesses the administration’s progress and makes new recommendations

silhouette of people holding hands by a lake at sunset

An open letter from EPA staff to the American public

“We cannot stand by and allow this to happen. We need to hold this administration accountable.”

wildfire retardants being sprayed by plane

New evidence links heavy metal pollution with wildfire retardants

“The chemical black box” that blankets wildfire-impacted areas is increasingly under scrutiny.

Stay informed: sign up for The Daily Climate newsletter
Top news on climate impacts, solutions, politics, drivers. Delivered to your inbox week days.